Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hi, I'm Sarah, and welcome back to the Midlife Happiness project. Today you'll have the opportunity to hear from two really interesting people about how they stay happy, both as individuals and as a couple. I sit down with a very happily married couple who share their secrets to how they stay in sync. And interestingly, this means finding activities that they can do together, but also giving them the freedom to pursue their own personal passions and interests. And we'll also hear about their fearless approach to tackling new challenges. So join me again for the next episode of the Midlife Happiness Project.
Well, welcome back to the Midlife Happiness project. And today we have something kind of new. For the first time ever on this podcast, we don't just have one fabulous guest, we have two fabulous guests. And it turns out these guests are happily married. And I'd like to introduce you to my friends, Karen and David. Hi, guys.
[00:01:23] Speaker B: Hello.
[00:01:23] Speaker C: Hi, Sarah.
[00:01:24] Speaker A: Hi, there. Okay, so a little bit about Karen and Dave.
They have been happily married for 46 years. They have one adult daughter, one adult son, three grandchildren, and both are retired executives. Welcome to the show. So excited to have you guys.
[00:01:49] Speaker C: Thank you.
[00:01:50] Speaker A: Today, we're trying something a little different now that we have a couple on the show, and they're going to talk to us about what brings them happiness. But as it kind of an added little bonus, it's not just happiness for themselves, but as a couple of. We've spoke about this on our program before, that when you are in a couple and your kids leave home or you retire, you find yourself in this unique position, which can be kind of scary for some people. And a lot of people really want to take the time and make decisions moving forward with things that they can embark on, activities they can try out and that benefit not just themselves, but their relationship. So I think Karen and Dave can speak to that a lot.
But let's just start with asking, what is the thing? The thing that you guys would say is one of the things I should say that really brings happiness to both of your lives.
[00:03:04] Speaker C: You want to start?
[00:03:04] Speaker B: No. You mean start.
[00:03:09] Speaker C: I mean, it is fun to do things. We were kind of lucky. We met in college and grew up together. Yeah, basically grew up together, because, I mean, I've never had.
I've never lived alone. In fact, when we got to the house that we're in right now, which we bought when we'd been married 25.
[00:03:33] Speaker B: Years, when we came. Empty nesters.
[00:03:35] Speaker C: Oh, yeah. It was our empty Nester house. I have an office, and it's the first time I've ever had my own room because I shared with my sister growing up. So Dave had to knock if he wanted to come into my office because.
Very excited to have my own space. But we do. We spend a lot of time together, and we have always enjoyed doing things together. And I think, you know, not having.
I mean, I had the perspective of my parents, who have been married 72 years, but we thought this was how you did marriage, as you do everything together other than work. And we found that, you know, when we're in sync, we, you know, we do things together and we're in sync and we can share things, and I don't know.
[00:04:24] Speaker B: Except her office. We don't share her office.
[00:04:28] Speaker A: There'll be no sharing of the office.
[00:04:30] Speaker C: Well, in fact, that's. Oh, go ahead.
[00:04:33] Speaker A: I think that's great. I like your term in sync, because we were speaking a bit about this earlier, and I think it's really important for our viewers and our listeners to understand that Karen and Dave are both very independent, smart people who have their own stuff going on. But what we're talking about specifically is sort of this conscious effort to do some things together, and that really brings you guys together, and it just works out. I think you're unique in that. And maybe I'm wrong. It certainly comes across like it's sort of effortless, and you just have a lot in common, and so maybe you just naturally gravitate to similar things.
That might not be the case for a lot of people, but I just want to be not misrepresent, you guys, that you do all this stuff together all the time. It's just clearly what brings you happiness is finding things that you can do together.
[00:05:40] Speaker B: And one thing we found right when we became empty nesters and we're realizing we had more time together, was a volunteering, providing service to the Channel Islands National park.
We discovered it through Karen's independent work at the local botanic garden. We went on a trip with friends from her group there, and when we got down to the Galapagos, which was our destination, and they heard there was a group from Santa Barbara, they said, oh, you're from the Galapagos of North America. And Karen and I, who we think of ourselves as outdoor and aware and had lived in Santa Barbara for 20 years, never had heard that. So when we got back, we started digging into that.
[00:06:34] Speaker C: Yeah. So we became naturalists for Channel Islands National park, and we've been doing that 18 years.
And that's really, you know, we spend often a week at a time on Santa Rosa island or one of the other islands. And, you know, it's kind of like our own little second home. We get to have a little house and give people hikes and orient them. But we've really enjoyed doing that together. We kind of have almost a set menu, which is things we really enjoy. And of course, we have to pack them into a few little ice chests and haul them up so it's efficient. But we enjoy that.
[00:07:14] Speaker B: Yeah. And the time. The time we spend first. When are we going to commit that time?
Okay, now I've got to pack and prepare for that. All right. Have we reviewed the hike material? Have we? You know, that waterproof thing didn't work before. Did we buy a new one all that time?
It's time that we're both talking about the same thing. It's not me talking about new golf shoes and Karen rolling her eyes. And so the preparation time. And then out there, you know, we're not arm in arm all the time. When we're out there, one of us is giving a hike, someone else is doing something else. But we're saying, okay, who should do this hike? Who should do the orientation?
Who forgot to bring the chicken.
[00:08:03] Speaker A: The snacks?
I have to say, though, what I'm getting from you guys, which is really interesting, and I could be wrong here, but it sounds like a lot of these choices you're making in these activities that you are embracing seem to be based on two things, staying active. And the other is you both are, what we would say, intellectually curious. You like to learn, and that's, I think, an amazing thing that you have in common, because the nice thing is, if it wasn't working with, you know, the Channel Islands, it likely would be something else because you both want to learn and grow that way. And we had just recently another guest speaking to that, and I think it's really important.
So would you say I'm on the mark there with the two of you?
[00:09:05] Speaker B: Yes, I would say it was a service. Intellectually curious, wanting to be outdoors. But then there is definitely the element of being deliberate about, oh, there's something we can do together that.
That sort of cements it. You know, if either one of us had considered something like that, there would definitely be a how much time is involved if it was an independent activity. But when we wanted to do it together, it was kind of a no brainer.
[00:09:40] Speaker C: Well, kind of a counterexample is I decided to take up saxophone on my 60th birthday.
Wow.
Yeah. It was a big commitment. I mean, it's hard to learn an instrument in your not prime time, so. Yeah, but I worked hard and I joined the primetime band, which is a band in town. Very fun.
And I didn't, I don't think, I probably asked you if you were interested and you said no, you were still working. And then when you stopped working, Dave did join the band. I wasn't saying you got to do this, but he, of course, on the concerts, he was one of the ones that had to hand out programs.
[00:10:29] Speaker B: I'd rather be on the stage.
[00:10:33] Speaker C: But then he found that he wasn't practicing. He wasn't motivated to practice. Plays a flute, and so he wasn't getting better, and it was frustrating. And so he didn't keep it up, and I was fine with that.
[00:10:48] Speaker B: So, yeah, but you try it. I saw how much fun Karen was having with it, and I was enjoying her going from Moose calls to actually pleasant melodies.
And she said, this is my first team sport. This is the first time I've been part of a group. I love being around the music, surround.
[00:11:09] Speaker C: Sound, because, I mean, I played tennis growing up, but it's not really, you know, you're on a team, but you're always playing individual and no other sport. I mean, I liked sports in general, but they didn't have, you know, I was pretitle ix. So there weren't any women's sports except swimming and tennis. But anyway, so, yeah, I did consider this my first team sport where you had to act in concert and just. It was so lovely being surrounded by the sound. Sometimes I forget to play because I was just enjoying listening.
[00:11:44] Speaker B: So hearing that, as she described that to friends after three or four years and I was cutting back on my work time, I thought, okay, I will practice also, because as you get older, music is better for the brain. So, you know, I was multitasking that way.
And I knew Karen would enjoy having me there, but I just wouldn't make the time to practice. And then I was playing fewer and fewer notes. I was better when I first started than a year later.
[00:12:20] Speaker A: Well, I like the fact, though. It's not so much the end result, it's the fact that you tried it. Right. So my question then is what, at what point in your life was this something? Ever since you guys got married, you've always been, as you say, in sync and in tune with each other and have always been sort of focused on how can we strengthen this relationship? Has that always been the case? Or was there a certain time in your life that you thought, you know, we really should focus on this, be mindful of this because it's important moving forward.
[00:13:02] Speaker B: I remember one distinct event. I was painting a professor's house. I happened to eventually use that money to buy Karen's engagement ring. But I found out he was getting divorced. I sat down for lunch while I was painting the house with his wife, soon to be ex wife, and I'm thinking, misses Robinson, but didn't work out.
So I was asking her, or I think she wanted to talk, and I had an opening to say, you know, how did that develop? Or something to that extent? And she said, you know, ever since we got married, our lives just grew apartheid. I don't know how that affected me, but I know my parents didn't have lives that were close together and did a lot of the things together. So that combined with, from my very first job, Karen was wondering, why am I not coming home at 530? So Karen always had this bias towards, of course we're going to do this together. You know, you don't go off drinking with your buddies while I'm home. And I took that as loving behavior. I didn't take it as constricted.
[00:14:28] Speaker C: My mom tells a story, used to tell a story of she was a volunteer at church and there a lot. And one time she was there doing something, and the priest called her in. She's like, marge, Marge, I need you to. I'm doing some marriage counseling here. I need you to answer a question for me. Thinking he's gonna know the answer. And he says, so, I mean, how many times a week do you and Sherm argue?
And she says, well, we never argue.
And he wanted her to say, well, everyone argued.
[00:15:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:06] Speaker C: And she tells the story.
She. As.
[00:15:09] Speaker B: She doesn't realize the irony.
[00:15:11] Speaker C: Yeah, she doesn't realize the irony of it.
[00:15:13] Speaker B: She's very tightly.
[00:15:14] Speaker C: I know that they did argue, but I think when she told that story, I would think, oh, okay, you need to learn how to. Obviously, the priest was trying to tell the couple, you need to learn how to argue. You know, you're gonna have disagreements. So I did take the correct lesson out of it and thought, okay, we need to talk about things when stuff isn't going the way you want. And so that's one thing we really.
[00:15:44] Speaker B: Enjoy doing together, is cooking. But that was literally our first fight when Karen incorrectly made a grilled cheese sandwich. I still remember the apartment kitchen when she displayed this utter disregard for the right way to make a grilled cheese sandwich. And that was. Got a little testy for the next.
[00:16:08] Speaker A: The cheese sandwich that almost ended the marriage. That was quite a sandwich.
[00:16:13] Speaker B: We then expanded into, we figured out there are probably ten different ways to make grilled cheese sandwiches. And my mother's way was not the only way. And today, we do enjoy cooking a lot together, but nothing.
How would you describe how we do it?
[00:16:31] Speaker C: Well, I think we do, in most tasks, we do one does one thing and one does another, because when we try to both do something, we're each. Well, like one of our first arguments was we both. We wanted to wallpaper. This is how long we've been married. We were going to wallpaper in our first house. We did wallpaper and we did wallpaper, and neither of us had ever wallpapered before. So, you know, we read all the instructions, not online in a book, how to wallpaper. And we did a great job. And, you know, in a dinky, little, tiny little.
[00:17:05] Speaker B: Bathroom. Bathroom, right.
[00:17:06] Speaker C: Well, then the second room. We're both experts.
That's a problem.
[00:17:12] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:17:12] Speaker C: We both knew how to do it.
[00:17:14] Speaker B: And we both knew the right way to do it, and I think that's how we do cooking now.
Great. You take care of that, I'm taking care of this. I'm doing that. You're doing this.
But I think we deliberately, one of us doesn't go running away when the other's cooking. It's, oh, great, you're cooking now. Let's do that together.
There's a certain amount of deliberateness, but, oh, man, we were just so lucky that there's so many things we'd like to do together.
[00:17:48] Speaker C: And if I don't want you to help me with something, I just say, I got this out of the kitchen.
[00:17:53] Speaker A: Right, two or three times. And at the same time, you guys do have your own lives. And for example, if I didn't mention already, Karen is a published author, and my understanding is, Dave, with all due respect, you had nothing to do with said book, correct.
[00:18:10] Speaker B: Other than right at the very end. I did read it for editing purposes, but no, I couldn't. As a matter of fact, while she was writing it, I had to learn. I think I was in between jobs. I was consulting. That's another way of saying that I would come down the stairs every time a thought came into my head and wanted to share it with Karen. And I quickly learned that is not how we use our time in the house.
There's a time and a space for things, and every thought that comes into your head does not have to be shared right now.
[00:18:48] Speaker A: Right. So give us a sense. So you. You come back from this galapagos trip, this light goes on you realize not only is there this whole ocean life situation that you are unaware of, but also, hey, this is something we can both do together. Can you give us an idea of sort of that first day or the first time you guys really started getting involved with it, what that was like for you guys together?
[00:19:22] Speaker C: I was a docent at the botanic garden at the time, so I talked to people at the botanic garden and said, how do we get involved on the islands? And Steve Junak, who's a, he's retired now, but he was the botanist on the islands. He's an expert, has several books. And he said, well, there's some restoration groups. You can go out and do a plant restoration. We did that. We enjoyed it. Oh, we brought our kids who were in college. Must have been a summer after or something. And we just really liked being out there. And then I guess Steve told us that there was this, that there was a group and we could just go on the national park website, which we did. And they happened to have an upcoming class. It was three or four months long, once a week, 3 hours. And so we enjoy, I mean, we always enjoy learning. So it was enjoyable to learn about the islands and to be able to.
[00:20:25] Speaker B: Share and quiz each other. We got a stack of reading, which was like, honey, you know, Karen did her studying, I did mine. I was trying to catch up with her because she already knew a lot about the plants and things. And so it was, it is fun to know you're working on the same thing and amazingly, you remember different parts. Not amazingly, but you remember different parts of it. And so we were talking about the same thing and how we were learning, but it was new, so neither one of us was an expert.
So it was. It was a good way to have dialogue. Right. It gave us a common, you're kind.
[00:21:09] Speaker A: Of starting off in the same place as opposed to you being an expert tennis player. And then Karen coming in and there's always going to be, well, I'm playing, but we're not on the same page.
[00:21:22] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:21:23] Speaker B: Yes. I think that was probably a key factor. And so it was fun and exciting.
Most of the people were singles. There was just one or two other couples. So that was kind of nice to kind of stick out in that way. And then once we got out on the first was the boats, the well watched boats.
[00:21:45] Speaker C: Well. And he. David's much more outgoing than I am, so I might have. I might have done 150% of the reading, and Dave's done half the reading, and yet he's out there describing the whales and everybody, you know, I'm thinking, or is it 40ft long?
I have a need to not say anything wrong, you know, so I'm kind of boxed in. But I would see that how he just helps people enjoy the whales, you know?
So I think I've learned to be more outgoing watching him.
And what have you learned from me?
[00:22:25] Speaker B: To get to stick to the facts a little bit more. It makes it easier when people ask questions.
[00:22:30] Speaker A: I, by the way, can relate to this totally. I like to say I'm talking to people. I'm saying my thing. Scott says nothing. And on the drive home he's like, you know, a good portion of what you were talking about was inaccurate. I'm like, right. But they liked hearing me talk about it. And isn't that really what's important?
Yeah.
[00:22:54] Speaker C: Yeah. You guys are like the parallel image.
[00:22:58] Speaker A: So here's another question.
[00:23:00] Speaker B: The mirror image.
[00:23:01] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:23:02] Speaker A: So I have another kind of question for you. Maybe something you haven't thought about, but. So here it is. How has you guys finding things, not just one thing, but an array of things to do together. Clearly it's made you happy as a couple.
When you think about how that has made you happy as a person for yourself. In other words, has it had positive benefits? Maybe even your relationships with your children, with other people?
It could have religious or spiritual benefits, anything like that. Can you comment on that?
[00:23:52] Speaker C: I mean, all those benefits are. I mean, it's like icing on the cake. So we enjoy doing things together and it's a so and it feeds all of those things. So, you know, we enjoy, we go to church together and we have since college. And when one of us doesn't want to or says, really? The other one is, you know, kind of takes up the slack and says, you know, this is important and safe.
[00:24:21] Speaker B: Or sympathetic and going, yeah, let's not.
[00:24:24] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, let's not. Okay.
[00:24:26] Speaker C: I mean, I like the fact that we have. I feel like we're a good example to our kids of how a marriage can work. Not have to be. But.
So I think it's been a benefit that way.
But I mean, mostly it's its own benefit.
It's just made life more fun. I mean, I'm just.
I mean, he is just. He's a lot more fun than I am. So I get to ride on this fun balloon and, you know, I have to put him back in his place once in a while, but keep him in line.
[00:25:02] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:25:03] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:25:03] Speaker B: Well, there, one thing I really enjoy is watching tv. Now, of course, this, the college sports I, like, I cannot get Karen to commit to watching tv anywhere near as much as I would like to.
[00:25:22] Speaker C: Well, you could read.
[00:25:23] Speaker B: I know Karen Reid's ferociously.
[00:25:28] Speaker C: If you read more.
[00:25:29] Speaker A: I was gonna say I was waiting for that.
[00:25:34] Speaker B: So. But because we do things, you know, there's things we do together, I just wait till she's voraciously reading and watch tv, then.
[00:25:49] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:25:50] Speaker B: So it's being comfortable knowing, you know, just knowing that we've done enough things together that we're, you know, that I'm not looking over my shoulder and wondering, what's she mumbling to herself? You know? I know what she's mumbling. It's he's a lost cause, but.
[00:26:12] Speaker A: Right, because, I mean, at the end of the day, you still have to nurture your own interests, it. Tv or whatever else it is. If that's your thing, you shouldn't. If you overlook that and you're always thinking, oh, well, everything has to be a group or collective effort. Right? I mean, that's not fair either.
The other thing I was going to ask you about is, since you have these similar interests and you live your life on the same page and you do a lot together, do you guys, would you say you have your own separate group of friends that you do your own things with, or has it kind of been more, you have couple friends and, you know, those are the friends you have?
[00:27:02] Speaker C: Yeah, I'd say most of our closest friends are couple friends, but we each. I guess I have more individual friends than you do.
[00:27:13] Speaker B: And you knew more with your couple counterpart than I do.
[00:27:18] Speaker C: Right.
[00:27:18] Speaker A: But that's a female thing, though, I have to say.
[00:27:23] Speaker C: Yeah. And there have been times when, like, I'm gonna. I don't think lately, but, like, I would want to do something or take a walk with one of my girlfriends, and Dave's like, I could come. It's like, that's okay.
[00:27:35] Speaker B: Really, though, think about that sometimes.
[00:27:40] Speaker C: He does think he's one of the girls.
[00:27:43] Speaker B: I'd like to be one of the girls. I know I'm not one of them.
From a young age, I found women have girls, and women have much more interesting conversation than, oh, well, we could.
[00:27:57] Speaker A: Have a program dedicated exclusively to the nature of female. Female versus male relationships. And I know nowhere is this more clear when then, when you're raising teenagers and the drama with girls is up to here, and the fights, the upset, and then the boys argue for all of a minute, and then it's all forgotten about and, you know, the girls don't understand that, but on the flip side, I don't want to say that men don't have close relationships, but I think it's safe to say women tend to, like, you're saying, foster relationships with their, you know, their girlfriends put in the work maybe more than men. Again, that's a huge generalization, but there is some truth to it.
[00:28:47] Speaker C: Yeah. Yeah. I have to remind him to send his brother a birthday card.
[00:28:52] Speaker A: Right.
[00:28:53] Speaker C: I don't really want to, you know, so I'll skip, but then I'll feel bad because the guy should get a birthday card, you know?
[00:28:58] Speaker A: Right.
[00:28:59] Speaker B: Hey, I'm putting in my work with my wife. I don't need to put it in.
[00:29:03] Speaker A: With someone else now. It's not work.
This is what you love to do. So let me, okay, let's, let me ask this one final question then, because you guys, I think, are a great sort of role model for people. You may not see it as that, but I certainly do.
What is, maybe not the, but what is a, a piece of advice you would give to somebody in their, let's say, fifties who is, again, at that time where maybe if all goes according to plan, the kids are leaving home, maybe they're lessening their workload and they're listening to a program like this because, of course, they're huge fans and they're starting to think the wheels are turning. You know what? I really do have to put in some work here, be deliberate and conscious about how I want to spend the next part of my life with my partner. And what does that look like? So what kind of advice would you, would you give for somebody like that?
[00:30:16] Speaker B: Well, one thing right away is, first of all, the realization that you might live for 40 more years. So in some senses, there's not a rush. And that relates to don't think you need to survey the countryside. If there's something that seems interesting, focus and dive down into it a little bit interesting. You know, get, peel back a few layers, commit a little bit. You might, after years, say, no, that's not for me. But you'll never know that if you're kind of waiting and looking around and you might have five or six interests like that, but you'll never enjoy any of them if you don't make a little commitment. So get a commit, dive deep, dive into it. And that's when you see, is this something that takes up a lot of my time? And if you're tired of being out on the golf course with those buddies because you've been doing it for a year, once a week or once a month now, you know, and think of all the time you've freed up.
[00:31:26] Speaker A: Right.
[00:31:27] Speaker B: To work on something. So I would say make a little commitment beyond just surveying the field when you have new time.
[00:31:38] Speaker C: I like that. I would say be intentional about, you know, listing list things you've enjoyed over the years and some things you've wanted to try and didn't have time for, things you do want to do together and things you want to do as an individual. And it's nothing, not a, you know, so it's have conversations. Well, with yourself and with your partner. If you have a partner that, so you're not just getting into ruts and things, but that you have your list of, you know, I've always wanted to try that. I'm going to try it. Or you look at that list and you say, that doesn't interest me anymore, but it's kind of guide to that helps when you don't feel like some days you're off and running and other days it's like, how long does this just kind of go on? And when you have something written down, you can look at that and get new energy.
[00:32:43] Speaker A: But, yeah, I think what you also, what I'm getting from you guys is that you're sort of, frankly, fearless and you embrace challenges. Because it's one thing to say, I've always liked this. I've been interested in it.
Well, for example, playing a saxophone. I'm sure people listening are like, that sounds awesome, but that is like, so much work. I don't even know if I could learn it. So before I even go there and let myself even contemplate that, let's just cut it off right now because I'm probably not even going to be good at it. I don't know where I got off thinking that I was qualified to do this, you know? And so there is a degree of being sort of fearless and throwing yourself into something and sort of, well, first of all, empower yourself to say, look, I'm capable. I can learn this. But frankly, if it doesn't work, work out, what's the worst that can happen? You just pivot and move on to something else. Right. And so that's, that is definitely something that you have in your corner and you're open to challenges, which is really an important part because I think sometimes, I think as people get older, there's this idea that you want to be comfortable, and often being comfortable means you just don't move outside your box. You don't push boundaries. Maybe you just keep doing what you've always done, because if it ain't broke, why fix it, right? But to your point, Dave, I mean, you still have a lot of life, so if you're going to try something, do it now.
[00:34:31] Speaker C: Well, in age, one of the really great things about age is you don't have to work only at things that you think you can be expert at. You can be mediocre and enjoy it. You know, I love that.
I probably never got better than mediocre at saxophone, but I loved it to pieces.
[00:34:50] Speaker A: But I think that's, that's like such a great message right there, because when you think about it, right. So many people don't do things unless they're going to be operating at a certain level, especially if you're a performer at work and, you know, you had sort of a position of maybe being the boss or being in control of something, and you're used to sort of running the show and this idea of, well, I could start something, but maybe I'll always be, like you say, mediocre, but that's okay because I'm not. There's no real end game here other than me just enjoying the process. It's not like you're going to necessarily join the philharmonic or whatever. That might not be in the cards, but that's not going to lessen your interest in doing it well.
[00:35:41] Speaker C: And by playing saxophone, my granddaughter picked it up. So to me, that's the ultimate success.
[00:35:48] Speaker A: Right.
Well, I love your advice, and I think your perspective is really refreshing, and it encourages, certainly, the people watching or listening to, to be mindful of how they want to proceed with their life, but with their partner. And that, of course, you're free to be your own person and be independent, but for the benefit of your relationship and your personal happiness, it's definitely a benefit, as we see with you guys, to think about these things. And as we've said before in our show, we really try to put this out there that I think sometimes people have an idea that if with relationships, in any relationship, if it's a good relationship, things just organically happen. Right. It shouldn't be work. If it's a great relationship, it just kind of moves on its own and it always works out. And anybody who's been married for any period of time knows that's not true. And this is just another extension of that, which is you have to think about these things, especially when it is just the two of you at home.
Right?
[00:37:05] Speaker C: Right.
[00:37:06] Speaker B: I'm still working on some things.
[00:37:07] Speaker A: Yeah, we're all working on it.
It has been such a pleasure to have you guys on the show. And I know a lot of people, again, are really going to think about what you've said today. And you've been really excellent guests. And as I mentioned before, our first guest couple. So this is a first for the show.
[00:37:32] Speaker B: Well, thank you for having us. I've gotten something out of each one of the interviews you've had or conversations you've had with other people.
Even though I'm a happy guy already.
[00:37:44] Speaker A: You clearly are a happy guy, mister happy.
[00:37:48] Speaker B: So thank you. Thank you for that.
[00:37:50] Speaker A: Of course, of course. To you guys. To both of you.
So in the several years that I've known Karen and Dave, I have constantly been inspired by their energy and their positive outlook. And I've always wondered, like, how do they do it? And I think our discussion today really help shed some light on their secrets on how to be happy as a couple. We had a great conversation, and they focused on the two things that they credit for adding real happiness to their life. And the first is how Karen and Dave stay in sync, as they referred to it. And what I thought was really interesting was that it does not mean that they do everything together. They deliberately look for activities that they can do together, but they still support each other's separate interests and activities. And I think this is a very doable, very simple and healthy approach to being happy as a couple.
The other point that they made was about how they tackle new challenges. And I loved how Karen made the point that you don't have to be limited to activities that you're going to be an expert at. You can still be mediocre at something and still have it make you really happy. And I think that's, that's pretty empowering. And I know that I have a number of friends who've been very successful in their careers, and they hold unreasonably high standards for themselves. And they often seem to be reluctant to try new things because they don't want to embarrass themselves as a newbie. And it seems that you do not have to be the best in the class to find happiness in trying something new. And I'm glad that I could really introduce you all to Karen and Dave. They are definitely two people that seem to have this whole happiness thing figured out.
And on that note, thank you so much for joining us today for the Midlife Happiness project, and we so appreciate your support. We would love it if you would just go ahead and subscribe to the Midlife Happiness project so that we can keep bringing you these episodes and hopefully continue inspiring you to find your happiness. Thanks so much for joining us.
[00:40:35] Speaker C: It's a good day.
[00:40:37] Speaker B: It's a good day.
