Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to the Midlife Happiness project, and I'm your host, Sarah. Imagine you're walking on a secluded beach with your spouse, and out of nowhere, a crazed maniac starts shouting, cursing at you, and then charges directly at you. What would you do? How would you react? Well, Charlie, who's our guest today, faced this exact nightmare around ten years ago. In today's episode, you'll hear how Charlie protected himself and his wife by tapping into his karate training from his childhood and how this scary event inspired him to get back into a dojo and start karate training again. Also, be sure to stick around for my wrap up, where I dig into some research that indicates that there are important physical and mental benefits for martial arts training for adults. Turns out that there's more to karate than just being a badass.
Welcome back to the Midlife Happiness project. I'm Sarah, and I'm here with another great guest. His name is Charlie. He is a husband. He's a father of three children. He is the CEO of an it firm and a fellow canadian. Welcome to the program today, Charlie.
[00:01:31] Speaker B: Thanks for having me.
[00:01:33] Speaker A: Absolutely. Okay, so today is going to be a great episode, something that we've talked about in past shows that I think is really resonating with our viewers and our listeners, which is this idea of sort of revisiting your childhood and accessing those memories, those things that made you happy when you were young. And despite the fact that you might be older now, the reality is you're still you. And those things that made you happy back in the day may still make you happy. You just sort of reintroduce it and maybe reconfigure it so it fits your more mature life now. And this story around Charlie is sort of along those lines. And so, as we do with every beginning of every show, we'll ask you, what is that thing, that thing that you've introduced into your life recently that has really made you happy?
[00:02:36] Speaker B: Right. Well, it's. It's karate. It's karate.
Ever since I can remember Bruce Lee, martial arts movies have been a big thing for me. I can remember setting up pillows in my living room and literally flying over them. A sidekick.
So Bruce Lee early on, and then Chuck Norris movies really caught my attention. I just loved the. I loved the. The feeling of what was it like just knowing you could defend yourself. Right? Like, just knowing you could be. You could be tough when you needed to be, or. Yeah, I guess that was it. Yeah. So, karate.
[00:03:23] Speaker A: So I noticed you referred to it as karate. I assume. I only know it as karate. But karate is the proper.
[00:03:31] Speaker B: Yeah, if I. If I don't say karate, then I'm gonna catch it at the dojo if someone watches this podcast. So. Karate. Yeah, I mean, it's. Yeah, it's the same thing.
[00:03:41] Speaker A: Okay, so let me ask you this. When you decided to reintroduce this into your life, it sounds like this is something you've been. You did when you were much younger.
How did that come about? How did you. Did you think about it and consciously brought it back in? Is this something that you just something reminded you of it? What sparked that interest to reintroduce it into your life?
[00:04:10] Speaker B: Well, yeah, I mean, a reintroduction, because I was originally found my dojo in the mid eighties. My brother introduced me. So, yeah, it was 20. Well, actually, now it's, what, 40, almost 40 years later, maybe 35 years later for me. But it's always been on my mind, so I can't tell the new story of discovering it without going back to the original training. My experience of the senseis, the black belts, the teachers were when I first walked into the dojo, I mean, these guys were bigger than life. And there was always this magic to me around martial arts. Like, it's magic, right? There's like, how do you anticipate defending yourself, or how do you anticipate these sparring techniques, fighting techniques? Well, it turns out it's just practice, right? And so you learn how to punch correctly, you learn how to block correctly, you learn how to kick correctly, and then you practice it. You fight a lot. So I was around men who I watched them fight, and there was no magic. It was just, they were really good at fighting. And so this was unique to our system is there's a lot of fighting and training and a lot of mutual respect. A lot of. A lot of ancient japanese culture brought in, so there's this really neat system of tradition. And so all this together was just really pinged with me. It was a time in my life I really needed guidance. I was, you know, getting in some fights, and my dad wasn't around, and so I really experienced the dojo, and my sensei is like these father figures, and it was very powerful experience for me. And so when I trained a couple of years on and off, and then when I left to kind of pursue life and it dropped off, it always been in the back of my head as a path I wanted to get back on at some point.
It was tough, though. I mean, breaking fingers and breaking toes when you're kicking a bag or kicking someone and you hit them in the elbow by accident, it hurts, and sparring hurts. So it was kind of easy just to kind of put it off till next year or when I have time. And running a company takes a lot of time. Raising kids takes a lot of time. And when am I going to find the time to train all day, right? So.
So then what brought me, what brought me back to karate was my son.
We were looking for a dojo for him, and I was a corset popped up and my wife asked me, do you want to go to this dojo or that dojo? And I was, I knew if I took him to my old dojo, that means I was going to be in, too, right? So I was just, just a little reticent on jumping in.
And so we explored various dojos in the city here. And my wife was pursuing it. Some jiu jitsu, some other karate, some other dojos. Well, she picked one, and my son went to a few. I was like, okay. I was kind of doing my own thing still, you know, doing business. Well, then I went into the dojo once to see the him in a class, and I was in there about five minutes, and I said, that's enough. We're out of here. I took him out. I said, okay, here we go. And I took him to my dojo.
And then that's when I saw Sensei, who's now training me. Now, he was someone I had trained with way back when I had first gone. And we were friends in high school, and we, for all practical purposes, had started together at the same time back in the eighties. Well, here he is now. Continued on. He's like 7th dawn, which is like a 7th degree black belt. Perhaps he's 6th degree. Either way, he's been training for all this time that I've been gone. National champion. He's one of the most decorated fighters our dojo has ever seen and an incredible human being. And so when I walk in that dojo with him, it was, I was always hoping for this kind of homecoming. He made it that and my son right under his wing.
He went through his training, and then Tony looked at me and like, so when are you coming back?
I was think I started the next day.
[00:08:46] Speaker A: That was almost, and you're mentioning something which I think people would want to hear about, myself included. So when I think of karate, I mean, sure, you think of these Bruce Lee movies and whatnot, but I have heard, and you've alluded to this, there is a lot about discipline, respect, strategy. You're also referring to this gentleman that you're working with as being just an exceptional human being. So there's more to this than just this athletic pursuit. Can you speak to that?
[00:09:22] Speaker B: Yeah, it's hard. And so you kind of find most people who train, it's a reflection of how they pursue their lives.
Working, getting.
If you're in sales Monday morning, it's cold at 06:00 a.m. it's cold outside. It's much easier to stay in, watch podcasts than get out there and bang on doors. Right. Fighting training is hard, and so there's a discipline about it, getting in the. Getting in the dojo and working the community there, which what I found very powerful.
But, yeah, it it, again, you know, the pursuit of trying to better oneself is something we all share. And what's crazy about it is some of the most humble people now I meet are the people who have the most.
They're just so humble. And when I see them in the things they can do, it reminds me of, well, the more I pursued, the more I pursued my path in the dojo, the more calm I find myself in all other areas of my life. It's the time when I walk in those doors, I shut everything off. I don't ever do that anywhere else. If I go to the gym, I noodle. If I do it, when I go into the dojo, I shut everything off, and that's the time for me.
So it's a few things, but mostly the discipline of pushing through something that's really, really hard.
[00:11:10] Speaker A: Absolutely. And I love this idea that you're sharing about.
It essentially brings you happiness because it's this sacred time that you carve out for yourself, that you really invest in this activity, and you are fully involved in it and immersed in this, and that provides you happiness, but also you're being challenged, which is another theme that comes up in this podcast a lot. This idea that as we get older, we all just want to sort of hang out on a beach and play golf. And the more people we talk to, the more we realize this is not the case at all for successful, interesting, well rounded people. They all tend to share certain character traits, and one of those is, you know, they want to be challenged, and you always want to be learning and by extension of that, experiencing new things.
But that sort of theme continues to come up, and clearly that's the same for you.
[00:12:29] Speaker B: Oh, yes.
For me, the challenge is like, I love strategy, so. But puzzles, right?
[00:12:39] Speaker A: Yep.
[00:12:40] Speaker B: Yeah. Not a puzzle guy. I shouldn't say that. I like some math here and there, but, like, strategy, I love thinking this way, as I've. As I work more professionally. I really love the strategy, particularly when it comes to the human mind and how we relate to other people. So, for me, the idea where there's something on the line and you have to act quickly, set up your opponent, and then dominate them. Right. Or her.
In my case, it's mostly men I train with.
There's something to that. If you miss, you get immediate feedback, and it's kind of weird getting your bell rung.
You know, there's a story here that, you know, it was about 20 years ago where I got a chance to test my ability to be strategic in a real life and death situation. This is part of the. Part of the reason why I always remembered my dojo was coming back to me, because I had. I had to defend myself 20 years later with techniques I had learned 20 years previously. And there was a. My. My ex wife and I were on a beach in Santa Barbara. I had witnessed a couple of young men.
Well, one of them threw a homeless gentleman off a cliff, and luckily, he grabbed a tree and was. We were able to pull him up. But before I walked down the steps, I knew there was trouble down below. So step one, find. Find a weapon that I could use to defend myself. Part of my training. Don't find yourself in a situation where you're not prepared. So I found myself, basically a piece of driftwood that was a Louisville slugger. And it was. Right, so it was. But it was a walking stick. So I walked down the hill with my walking stick, my two dogs, and my. And my ex wife in tow. I come around the corner, I see two young women, and I just checked in on them. Hey, how are you guys doing? They had been drinking. I could tell they were. And so they said, they're fine. I said, okay, why don't you get on up? And then I looked down, and there was the two gentlemen that I had seen previously who had obviously been causing trouble. So I walked down the hill, and they were minding my. They were leaving me alone. So I was like, okay. I turned the corner to. To go down the beach with my. With my ex and our two dogs. And the next thing I know, this guy's in my face.
He's a tall. He was a tall guy, bigger than me, bald head. And I could see in his eyes he was on something. And he was mad because I was talking to one of these girls who apparently was with him. And so he was really mad, and he started spitting on me. And basically, to make this story shorter, he'd done it a few times, which I have a thing about spitting. If you spit on me, I just really makes me mad. And so he was provoking me and I told him several times, this is not going to go well. You know, take a hike. So after a lot of back and forth and getting kind of dicey, my heart was racing, everything. And I basically, at this point, I had pulled the weapon up and I had put my hand on him, knowing full well I wasn't going to take a chance with him getting the first shot in. It was rather scary. So his friend comes over, grabs him and says, come with me, you're drunk, or whatever he said, and he pulls them away from me and they're walking away.
They're about 25ft from me. There's two fishermen fishing off the beach there. And as I'm turning to walk away, I catch him out of my corner of my eye. He spins a away from his friend, picks up a pickaxe shovel that's used for digging holes. And it's got the serrated. It's not a pickaxe, it's a shovel with a serrated edge on it. And he's running at me full speed and he's getting ready to swing it. And I'm literally in real time going. I'm about to lose an arm or worse, or die. Yeah, it's crazy. So I literally. It's like, going. Going through my mind and so I just. I remember being super calm. So I had had the weapon up here by this time. I pulled it up and there's a move in our system where you close the gap on somebody. There's tsuriyash, which is just a kind of a little shuffle, and then there's a fumidashi, which is a. I close between six and 10ft on you like that. And then I strike or I do whatever. So he was running at me. And so right when he got within about 10ft, I just closed the last 8ft before he even knew it was coming. And I hit him in the head as hard as I could. And it was.
[00:17:33] Speaker A: With the. With the bad.
[00:17:35] Speaker B: Yeah, it was bad. And then I had him in a chokehold, kicked his legs out and I put him on the ground and I basically had his face in the sand and I was gonna. I was gonna end his life. I was so mad. And, like, adrenaline is pumped. Oh, yeah. Just. I could feel how strong I was and how. How, you know, jacked up. I was at the time. And then I was. Everyone around. Yeah. And by the way, everyone around me besides my wife was just like. They were all spectators blown away. I had already told this guy a bunch of times to leave me alone. Anyways, I whispered in his ear, like, basically, I told you not to mess with me, and. And then his friend came over, who? His friend was not nearly as intoxicated as him or not. What? But he begged me to let him go, so I let the guy go. Got up. I said, you know, get out of here. I don't. And so he got up. He walked away. I don't know how he did, but it turns out he went home later that day and tried to kill his father with a knife. The SWAT team took him down later, and I had to identify him in the hospital. And he was on something. Like, he was on something. I went to court. He wasn't gonna. He wasn't gonna. Plea deal. I showed up. As soon as I showed up, he took the plea deal. There was, like, 20 witnesses said I warned him, like, ten or 15 times I was going to kill him if he kept it up. So it was like, I checked every box, you know, I did. I did the right thing. In other words, I defended myself when I had to, but I didn't. So. So looking back on that, my friends at the time were 30, 35. You know, if I was 20, everyone would have been like, oh, yeah, I would have kicked their butts, too.
But what a weird experience for someone like 30, 35 years old to go through and see what I was made of when I had to.
Like, I would never trade that experience for a million, you know? Like, I don't want it to happen again, but knowing that I had it when I needed it, it was all that training. It was. I was a different. You know, I'm not used to hitting people with clubs. It's not something, but it was the same technique, right? It was the same technique, and I knew that that night was prepared for that, right? So.
[00:19:33] Speaker A: And you use these skills in a practical way because most people go to the gym, you do whatever it is you do, and then it ends the minute you walk out those doors. That must have been a crazy feeling. I mean, were people, like, clapping?
[00:19:49] Speaker B: It was in shouting. They were. They were all. It just was kind of weird because nobody wanted to help. It's kind of funny. The typical. Everybody was just like, what do I do here?
[00:19:57] Speaker A: Right?
[00:19:58] Speaker B: But. But the DA said you had, like, 20 witnesses. What were they doing? I go, I think they were just watching. But literally, because he tried to countersue, I think, for something, because I. I heard it pretty bad. I'm surprised he lived literally at that point. I didn't. I didn't care. But later on, when I saw him in court and his hair had grown out, and he was just a young man, you know, he was in his early twenties, 2021, maybe. Just a young man. So sad. And so I don't know what the. Whatever happened to him, but it was just unfortunate. And I'm so. I'm glad. I'm glad it didn't end his life, and. But I'm also glad that I was able to protect mine or my. Right. That's scary for somebody.
But it's something I think of all the time now. It's something that. Yeah, it's why when I train, I train for that, and then I never want to use it. But if I have to, I tell you, I love knowing that I can.
[00:20:56] Speaker A: Do you know how many people listening to this program are on their way to sign up for karate? I mean, this is, in a way, as terrifying as it is, it's a fantasy I'm sure people have in their head. Like, I have all these skills. I would just love for somebody to come at me, but God forbid they do. Yeah, but in your case, and it's. You didn't know this was happening. And from what you're telling me, you weren't super active, um, participating in character. This is. You accessed this knowledge and this, uh, confidence, um, and sourced it from when you were younger?
[00:21:38] Speaker B: Oh, yeah.
[00:21:39] Speaker A: And you remembered it for all that time?
[00:21:41] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Well, all these years later, even learning relearning kata, which is, you know, a series of moves you do to demonstrate, you know, certain forms. It's. It's awesome now. And when I was younger, I was like, I just want to fight or just want to learn a technique. But Kata, it's all these things you learn. You do them over and over and over. And in some of the classes we do, they're just really intense, so they become second nature. And so all that time I was away, I had been thinking about all these things all the time. I'd be thinking about it, like, okay if I go back my hook punch, you know?
Yeah, you just think of those things. And now to be back in the dojo, it feels like I haven't missed a beat. You know, even my sensei would say, mandy, your sidekicks are just phenomenal. And so I've been thinking about them for 25 years without practicing. So, yeah, it's kind of cool to put it all together.
And in that case, it certainly worked.
[00:22:35] Speaker A: So when you decided, okay, this is ever present in your mind, it's always there with you. Enough is enough. I'm going back. Okay. And tell me about that kind of first. Of course, it's not your first, but your first experience re entering this. What was that like when you went back for the first time?
[00:22:58] Speaker B: It's cool. Uh, so, yeah, so when I walked in the dojo and I saw sensei say hello, you know, oh, sue is what? It's os when you see each other, we greet each other that way. Os when you walk in the door. And he gave me a big hug, and he said, I'm glad you're here. And then I walked in, and I smelled the tatami mats. It smells like sweat, and, like, it just. They smell like nothing you've ever smelled. It's not bad smell. It's just, it doesn't smell like a gym. It smells like a dojo. And I hadn't smelled that 25 years, and so it just felt right. And then I put on my ghee.
He gave me one of his old geese.
[00:23:40] Speaker A: Because now you have to tell us, what is a ghee?
[00:23:43] Speaker B: A gi is a uniform. And so, normally, when you first start, you put on the uniform, it's like you pull it out, you put it on, and it's. They're just a little. But when you're. When you're training, you get a proper key, and they're like, they're heavy. They're just. And they snap when you kick. And so he's like, mister bats ready? So he gave me one of his geese, and then he gave me a white belt, and he says, hey, sorry, but you're, you know, you don't get to get your old rank back. You're going to start at the bottom. And I was. At first, I was like.
And I go, no, of course you do. You gotta.
Cause your rank in your belt shows other people your knowledge. And so if someone. I go in there, if I put on a green belt or whatever, then someone might ask me how to do a cotton, I'll be like, I don't know. So I just start from the bottom. And so now I'm actually gonna be testing because I got my green belt, and now I'm testing for my second degree green belt.
But the goal being I will be at Brown by the end of this year. But so I walk in, put the gee on, and the key felt great. And then. And then he started showing me everything from the beginning again. And I felt like.
I felt like I did when I went back to school, back to college. When I wasn't in college, I was not a college dropout, but I didn't have a college degree.
The minute I went back again at UCSB, I was now soon to be a college graduate. And it's the same way at the dojo, is the minute I was in there, I was back on the path. And so it felt like it wasn't. Oh, yeah, I used to train. It was like, oh, yeah, I trained, and it was. And it was true.
And so, yeah, I'm back on the path. And that's what it felt like. As you mentioned early on, some of these things we get back into aren't new discoveries, or I'm not reinventing myself. Like, oh, this is a cool new thing. I'm gonna go jump out of an airplane and be. No, I'm just getting back on the path. It was a path I. I was supposed to be on, and I took a detour, and that's okay. And now I feel like I'm on the path. And once you're on the path, like, who's gonna argue that?
[00:25:50] Speaker A: I like that. I like your. Your way of putting it that it's a detour. That's. That is. That's excellent, because, I mean, life is filled with detours, and I think people feel like there would be people in your situation that would say, oh, God, you know, yeah, I've thought about it. I've always had an interest in it. But you know what? I was a younger man then. That ship has sailed. Who's kidding who? You know, I'm not that guy anymore. And what the hell? No, you are that person.
People really don't change that much. And if you can access that and that re energizes your life.
Absolutely. And to that point, as it pertains to your happiness, obviously, I can tell you, like, you light up when you talk about it. It's very inspiring and motivating, and it gets you really pumped up and excited and. And I get that. But as it pertains, if you were to put it in words, what about karate makes you happy?
Does it have benefits? Socially, emotionally, obviously, physically, spiritually? Relationships with people? Your kids, your wife?
Because I say that. Because happiness is obviously so multifaceted.
[00:27:20] Speaker B: You know, I play hockey. You know, I get it. I put on the armor with the boys before we go out there, and we go out there and we battle. Right? And for me, the idea, like, I'm trying to, basically trying to round myself out or off, right. And, you know, hopefully I've got 20 to 30 good years left, and I want to make those good years. And so playing hockey, being in the dojo, is going to extend that without a doubt being physical.
But I also like the notion that I can be dangerous if called upon. And this is a little Peterson esque.
And then choose not to be.
Like, for me, growing up, the Clint Eastwood who would ride into town, he was a little shady, but he always did good. Like that notion of be lethal and then do nothing but love and be good with your life. To me, that's been like the, was that archetype that I'm just, I'm going for, like, that's the thing. I want to be, for me, I want to be lethal. It's something that I've always wanted to be lethal and then love the heck out of people. And, you know, I remember a kid was getting beat up. That was actually high school. He was getting picked on. So a minute later, I jumped over and said, okay, now you got a problem with me because why are you picking on him? I don't like, I don't like bullies. I don't like, I don't like injustices. It gets me. That's why when the guy was spitting on me at the beach, I was just like, oh, he just, you know, trigger the daylights out of me. I just don't like injustices or bullies or, and, you know, a little bit of that, of that is like, oh, I'm the sheriff kind of complex.
And I don't necessarily need, you know, I don't need to find myself in problem situations under the guise of, well, I'm doing the right thing. Right. I kind of hid from that a little bit when I was a kid. In other words, I would jump into to save the day or to be the sheriff. Well, I could have easily avoided all that. I think, now that I'm older, you know, I love making new friends. Even if someone started off as a proverbial or an enemy, like, in other words, they just, it was difficult to get going. They're difficult. The younger me would have gone to war, gone to battle, got in a fight. Now I'm like, oh, I'd love to just win this person over. Right? But the idea of it all being backed by being lethal, if I can be, and then seeing how that measures up to my peers and then being older and then getting in there with 25 and 30 year olds and holding my own, it's something that's just.
I love it. Yeah, I love it.
[00:30:16] Speaker A: Well, it sounds. I mean, you can tell by listening to you that this is something that brings you. And again, I know so many, well, women, too, but certainly men listening to this are going to be all fired up because you really express this. This excitement, and I think it's great. But I have to ask, are your sons on the same path, or did they try it and it's not for them.
[00:30:45] Speaker B: So I have two girls and a boy, and so my oldest daughter wasn't for her. My youngest daughter just. Just literally a couple days ago said, I don't want to go back, but she said that a few times and gone back. So doors open on the youngest, Ryan. Zach, my son, is all in. Of course, he's all. He's all in on hockey, too. So I got to find something that I don't do to put him in to see, because I don't want him to just follow in my footsteps. Well, yeah, well, not. You know what I mean? I want him to find his own path, but he loves it. And he also doesn't have the thing, like, you know, obviously I'm around, and I want to be part of his life. And it's. It's literally the. One of the biggest parts of my life is being a. Being a parent to all my children, three of them, so doing things differently for him and making his life different and their lives different. But he, so far, he really loves. He loves karate, and he's. He's testing for another belt here just around the same time I am, so he loves it.
[00:31:48] Speaker A: And out of curiosity, you're talking about a green belt, a brown belt. For those of us that know nothing about this, how many belts are there?
[00:31:55] Speaker B: So, in our system, it's very traditional, so we don't have a lot of colors. So used to be, it's just. So you start with white. You get green, brown, and then black, but there's three stripes of green, and then there's three stripes for brown, meaning you get your green belt, and then when you turn second degree green belt, you get a stripe on it, and then a third degree green belt, another stripe, and then you turn to brown. It's the same way with brown. So they do add a couple of stripes for the younger kids because waiting so long for your first belt isn't as cool when you're six or seven, but, yeah, it's basically white, green, brown, and black.
Yeah.
[00:32:36] Speaker A: Okay. Well, because you mentioned you're looking to get your brand, but I assume you're going all the way with this.
[00:32:43] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Absolutely.
[00:32:46] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:32:46] Speaker B: I'll be. Yeah. Because now, now starting to work with the kids, you know, I go in in the afternoons and I'll work with my son, and then I'll be teaching other kids kata. And I love it. So I could see, I just. There'll be a point when that's what I'll be doing. I'll be in there teaching karate.
[00:33:01] Speaker A: Oh, that's awesome.
[00:33:02] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:33:02] Speaker A: That is awesome. So for all. I mean, so many people listening today, I know you guys out there are listening to this. And you know what? Karate might not be your thing. Who knows what it is? It could be anything. But this is infectious. This listening to Charlie reminds us that sometimes we don't have to do these huge, big life changes and pivot and be so extreme. Sometimes it's just accessing what was there all along and just giving it new meaning into our life now as adults. So that's something I think we all should sort of think about. Definitely. And on that note, thank you so much for being our guest today, Charlie. So appreciate it.
[00:33:47] Speaker B: Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.
[00:33:49] Speaker A: Absolutely. Absolutely.
Okay. So if you're like me, you're probably not Bruce Lee or Chuck Norris. But I was inspired by Charlie's enthusiasm, and so I decided to do a little research into the benefits of martial arts like karate for adults. Not only is karate a great form of exercise for all ages, but it also is great to improve, strengthen mobility, aerobics, endurance, flexibility and balance. And it's also shown to be very beneficial for mental health. In fact, martial arts training was found to help improve self esteem. It reduces stress as well as anxiety.
So I guess you don't need to battle villains like Bruce Lee does or even fight off crazy people on the beach like Charlie to benefit from giving martial arts a try.
And with that, in the inspirational words of Mister Miyagi himself, wax on, wax off. And with that, we'll see you next time for the Midlife Happiness project.
